VGCollect Forum
General and Gaming => Off Topic => Topic started by: htimreimer on March 22, 2016, 09:24:33 pm
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its coming out on the 25th and its already has a 39% ( 30% for top critics) on rotten tomatoes, i was hoping it would be good but it seem like its going to be a big old disappointment :'(
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Idk after watching Deadpool I can't imagine any superhero movie topping it anytime soon in terms of action or sheer creativity.
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I'm hearing that critics aren't liking it, but fans are actually liking it more. I'm gonna go, not gonna read anything, mostly just wanting a good superman vs batman fight. I'll be alright with the movie if they get that right lol
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kamikazekeeg: I get such a kick out of that animated GIF you have in your signature, watching those super heroes rocking the house. Where did you find that?
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My best friend wants to go opening night. I'm not much of a super hero movie fan myself. So I might go. I just hate crowds. I rather go on a weds morning at like 10 am. But he usually is working. HAha.
So I might suck it up and go Thursday night
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I'll be there Saturday. This is a comic fanboy's dream movie.
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I'll be there Thursday. A quick glance at a beginning of a review from a reviewer I like (Chris Stuckman) said he generally liked it, though it had problems and apparently the stuff between Batman and Superman is great, which is what I wanting. Particularly Batman being great which I had thought since the beginning that he'd probably be fine.
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kamikazekeeg: I get such a kick out of that animated GIF you have in your signature, watching those super heroes rocking the house. Where did you find that?
It's from this :P https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qatmJtIJAPw
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kamikazekeeg: I get such a kick out of that animated GIF you have in your signature, watching those super heroes rocking the house. Where did you find that?
I overlooked this on accident, but Matimo with the save as it's Batmetal. Basically a Batman parody built around the music of Dethklok from Metalocalypse :)
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its coming out on the 25th and its already has a 39% ( 30% for top critics) on rotten tomatoes, i was hoping it would be good but it seem like its going to be a big old disappointment :'(
I'd say I'm surprised at these scores but I'd be lying. :P
I'm a HUGE DC fan with years and years of comics collected. I'd estimate a good 75% of my collection is DC published books. Superman and Batman are soundly and without question my numbers 1 & 2 favorite super-heroes (with Spider-Man, DC's Captain Marvel & the Huntress rounding out my top 5 for those curious ;)). That said, this looks/feels/sounds TERRIBLE to me. I can't see myself willingly paying money to see this. Now that they've released more trailers it seems to me that they're trying to really shoehorn in as much as they can to kick start/ramp up their own Cinematic Universe. Apparently they learned nothing from Green Lantern. ::)
I imagine it will do well enough money wise but It'd be funny if it tanked like the FF reboot did. ;D
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^ Who did they shoehorn into Green Lantern? Every character was a GL character.
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Bad as in not as good as expect or bad as in Aliens vs Predator: Requiem?
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^ Who did they shoehorn into Green Lantern? Every character was a GL character.
That's the problem. The scale of movie was too ambitious. This isn't some hindsight is 20/20 thing; they should have just copied Marvel's style tit-for-tat and copied the pace of something like the first Iron Man movie. Green Lantern came off to me as some overly anxious grand epic wannabe instead of being a decently entertaining and well written popcorn flick. ;)
What Green Lantern should have been was him getting the ring and taking on an Earth level threat. Given his rather weak rogues gallery, Hector Hammond probably would have been the best choice as I'm sure characters like The Shark, Tattooed Man or a fellow who goes by the name Evil Star wouldn't go over well with audiences. :P Once the Earthly threat is contained, they then should have opened up the mythos at the end of the movie and shown that Hal was just one of a couple thousand active duty Green Lanterns. Up until that point at the end of the movie there should have been no Guardians. No Kiliwog, Tomar Re or any other GLs. Definitely no Parallax. Sinestro should have made a brief appearance at the end to fetch Jordan and that's it. That way, people anticipate a sequel and if they were truly ambitious about having a Cinematic Universe in the vein of Marvel's, they could have dropped plenty of references throughout the movie like equipment bearing LexCorp or WayneTech logos, made allusions to "the alien protector of Metropolis" or revealed other Easter eggs like showing footage of an "Aquaman" hanging out on some rocks by the ocean who dives into the sea when he realizes he's being filmed. :P
Based on what I've seen in the trailers, BvS appears to be heading down that same path as the GL movie. I want it to be entertaining and a foundation for a good Cinematic Universe but them dropping Doomsday on us doesn't exactly get my hopes up. :o
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Batman v Superman is not the 30% it is on Rotten Tomatoes, but it has some big issues. I can put them down to three major issues, two of which I was expecting, one I didn't. I won't spoil anything story related, but I have some opinions and if trying to go fresh as possible, best to not read below.
-They are rushing the next movies to build up to Justice League, so they shove everything they needed into this one movie to set up everything. Wonder Woman was handled well, I was fine with her setup. Same for Batman. They hint at some things we kinda already saw in trailers, but it would lead into the Batman movie that could be good. The problem is, they are not only trying to setup plot elements of the Justice League movie, but they blatantly show us Cyborg, Flash, and Aquaman. And not in a quick tease, but like there is a moment where we get good long looks at all three. It stops the movie for no reason. They teased them perfectly before, but then it's "NO, JUST LOOK AT THEM. THEY ARE COMING". Them doing this adds like 15 minutes to the movie at the very least for both of the future movies setup.
-Lex Luthor is awful. Eisenberg was a miserable choice. You know what he should've been cast as? The Riddler! He might've made for the best Riddler in the Batman movie. In this movie, Lex is not intimidating, he's not scary, he isn't threatening really beyond some actions he takes in this. I don't know what they were thinking. It's a shame that Kevin Spacey was wasted as Lex in Superman Returns. You have Kevin Spacey here as Lex, you got yourself an incredible Lex Luthor.
-Batman kills people. This isn't like in the recent Arkham Knight game where Batman driving around in his car that stuns guys as he hits them and they want to play it off that they are fine. I'm fine with a brutal Batman. No, he kills people on purpose. It's such a problem, because I think Batman in this is great. When we get that Batman movie, I'm so excited, because this is a great Batman. Affleck nails it, the suit looks great, there's some serious story they tease about what happened in his past that could make for an amazing movie. But he kills people and it's never in a Man of Steel kind of why, where it's a huge struggle for Superman to not kill Zod, no he just doesn't care if people die in this. Which makes one great fight scene later kind of a problem, because if Batman will kill people, there's no reason for him to just not turn into the Punisher. It's something that I think they could do away with in the Batman movie by just ignoring the kills in BvS. It makes me wonder what the R rated cut of this will be, because it could just make Batman even more violent.
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-Batman kills people. This isn't like in the recent Arkham Knight game where Batman driving around in his car that stuns guys as he hits them and they want to play it off that they are fine. I'm fine with a brutal Batman. No, he kills people on purpose. It's such a problem, because I think Batman in this is great. When we get that Batman movie, I'm so excited, because this is a great Batman. Affleck nails it, the suit looks great, there's some serious story they tease about what happened in his past that could make for an amazing movie. But he kills people and it's never in a Man of Steel kind of why, where it's a huge struggle for Superman to not kill Zod, no he just doesn't care if people die in this. Which makes one great fight scene later kind of a problem, because if Batman will kill people, there's no reason for him to just not turn into the Punisher. It's something that I think they could do away with in the Batman movie by just ignoring the kills in BvS. It makes me wonder what the R rated cut of this will be, because it could just make Batman even more violent.
There was a conspiracy theory I read about this, which would have been AWESOME, basically, these movies are part of the Christian Bale batman trilogy, the head of wayne enterprises is now Slade Wilson, and Slade has donned the mask of the Bat, but since he's Slade, he's willing to kill. I don't know, I would have been more okay with that than Batman actually killing people, isn't that Batman's number one no no?
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I read a list of plot-points that happen in the movie and I have to say, I think Sharknado has a better story. This is supposed to be a big build-up toward a Justice League movie much like Marvel did for Avengers. I can't remember a Marvel movie this bad.
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I read a list of plot-points that happen in the movie and I have to say, I think Sharknado has a better story. This is supposed to be a big build-up toward a Justice League movie much like Marvel did for Avengers. I can't remember a Marvel movie this bad.
The new Fantastic Four movie? Elektra? The 1990 Captain America movie?
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I read a list of plot-points that happen in the movie and I have to say, I think Sharknado has a better story. This is supposed to be a big build-up toward a Justice League movie much like Marvel did for Avengers. I can't remember a Marvel movie this bad.
The new Fantastic Four movie? Elektra? The 1990 Captain America movie?
Marvel doesn't hold the cinematic rights to these characters and hence, aren't responsible for their quality.
But for the sake of argument, I was referring to the Disney-owned and released Marvel films such as Thor, Batman, Hulk, Iron Man, Captain America, Guardians of the Galaxy, etc. If you want to dig back into the (fairly) distant past, DC has pumped out some real schlock over the years. And I can't think of anything as heinous as George Clooney's bat-nipples, Mr. Freeze and the Riddler. Those movies have forever tarnished the reputation of Batman and DC in general.
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I read a list of plot-points that happen in the movie and I have to say, I think Sharknado has a better story. This is supposed to be a big build-up toward a Justice League movie much like Marvel did for Avengers. I can't remember a Marvel movie this bad.
The new Fantastic Four movie? Elektra? The 1990 Captain America movie?
Marvel doesn't hold the cinematic rights to these characters and hence, aren't responsible for their quality.
But for the sake of argument, I was referring to the Disney-owned and released Marvel films such as Thor, Batman, Hulk, Iron Man, Captain America, Guardians of the Galaxy, etc. If you want to dig back into the (fairly) distant past, DC has pumped out some real schlock over the years. And I can't think of anything as heinous as George Clooney's bat-nipples, Mr. Freeze and the Riddler. Those movies have forever tarnished the reputation of Batman and DC in general.
I don't know, I really didn't like the Ed Norton Hulk movie, but that's because I think Ed Norton sucks.
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I read a list of plot-points that happen in the movie and I have to say, I think Sharknado has a better story. This is supposed to be a big build-up toward a Justice League movie much like Marvel did for Avengers. I can't remember a Marvel movie this bad.
The new Fantastic Four movie? Elektra? The 1990 Captain America movie?
Elektra wasnt a bad movie ... just not a popular character. The movie was fine for what it was.
The new FF movie sucks more than a warehouse of Dysons. Its bullshit all the way through and the ending ... wut?
I dont recall a 1990 Cap movie.
And since it was mentioned below this post ... the Norton Hulk movie was fine too. I find the newer hulk movies much more entertaining than the Ferrigno Hulk. Just like King kong ... he is meant to be overdramatically large.
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I also want to mention the original topic. I dont see a reason for Batman vs Superman. In no world ever (realistic or comic) would Batman ever touch Superman. He is as much a "super hero" as Iron man. Entertaining, but at the end of the day, they are rich guys with cool toys.
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Lol one more thing. Dr Strange > all! I can not wait for this movie!!!!
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I don't know, I really didn't like the Ed Norton Hulk movie, but that's because I think Ed Norton sucks.
I loved that Hulk movie. The one before that with the mutant poodles was trash. I thought Ed Norton nailed it.
That, and we got to see Rickson Gracie slap the Hulk. Rickson Gracie is the only man that can slap The Hulk and get away with it. Even Bruce Banner knows it would be Rickson by armbar.
Brazilian Jiu Jitsu Humor 8)
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I read a list of plot-points that happen in the movie and I have to say, I think Sharknado has a better story. This is supposed to be a big build-up toward a Justice League movie much like Marvel did for Avengers. I can't remember a Marvel movie this bad.
The new Fantastic Four movie? Elektra? The 1990 Captain America movie?
Elektra wasnt a bad movie ... just not a popular character. The movie was fine for what it was.
The new FF movie sucks more than a warehouse of Dysons. Its bullshit all the way through and the ending ... wut?
I dont recall a 1990 Cap movie.
And since it was mentioned below this post ... the Norton Hulk movie was fine too. I find the newer hulk movies much more entertaining than the Ferrigno Hulk. Just like King kong ... he is meant to be overdramatically large.
I never watched Elektra, just heard it's not good, but I suppose maybe I'll try to give it a chance. I heard it's really really slow.
Haven't seen the new FF, but I have heard that Fox only made it so they wouldn't lose the license.
The 1990 Captain America movie is/was used a lot in jokes on Conan, it's pretty bad. Like hilariously bad.
My wife has actually been watching the old Hulk TV show with Ferrigno, and she absolutely loves it. But yes, she complained to me the other day... characters will be like "Oh my, he's so huge, he's like 7 feet tall" and I'm just like... yeaaaaaaaah, that's not very tall.
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Elektra is seriously one of the worst superhero movies ever made. Without a doubt. It's like 70s Captain America bad. And I liked the Daredevil movie, actually, and I'm saying this. If you like Power Rangers a lot, you might enjoy it. But that's not what Elektra is supposed to be about. Elektra is a killer ninja assassin.
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I've been hearing online that the initial critic reviews weren't good. But the fans are enjoying it.
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My best friend saw it last night and hated it.
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One reviewer of the movie said "It's like watching paint dry, but that is an insult to the paint."
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There was a conspiracy theory I read about this, which would have been AWESOME, basically, these movies are part of the Christian Bale batman trilogy, the head of wayne enterprises is now Slade Wilson, and Slade has donned the mask of the Bat, but since he's Slade, he's willing to kill. I don't know, I would have been more okay with that than Batman actually killing people, isn't that Batman's number one no no?
It's a big aspect of Batman. Not that he's probably never done it, I'm sure there are notable instances, but generally he's unwilling to kill people and won't use guns. It was a HUGE plot element of Batman Arkham City, I believe it's a big plot element of the famous Killing Joke story (Getting turned into an animated movie soon with Mark Hamil and Kevin Conroy doing the voice, fuck it's going to be good), and even the comic this movie borrows a lot of its plot from, The Dark Knight Returns, has Batman making a huge tank to take on the gangs that fires non-lethal rounds. Even still, to do this is just wrongheaded to begin with, because in the previous movie, Man of Steel, they got a lot of flack over Superman killing Zod, and that one could be justified and had a huge impact on Superman's character.
As for reviewers saying it was boring, I think that's kinda wrong to say. To me, the movie was never boring, it had enough interesting elements and action strewn throughout that I was kept engaged. It's like the one complaint I wouldn't put on it, it's mostly just a mess with the story.
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I know the general public isn't giving it the best reaction. But all the comic fans on the message boards and comic Facebook pages I'm a member of seem to love it. Which makes me hopeful, being a big comic fan myself.
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Saw it late last night, my buddy had an extra ticket so i went... It was decent..... not great, not terrible.... Didnt care for Lex Luthor or Lois.
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I'm going to preface this with saying, I know absolutely dick about DC comics and that universe. I just know that Superman isn't interesting to me. My n
Now, I saw the movie earlier today. I had a good time, but I went in with no expectations. There were some highs, lows, and WTFs.
This chode isn't how I'd picture Lex Luthor at all. He's not even bald. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Luthor is a criminal genius, businessman, and general gangster mfer, right? This guy was closer to the Riddler. He was nervous and cracking up. Not how I'd picture Luthor. I may be wrong though.
Affleck was one of my favorite Batmans. He is pissed! I dig it. I loved Daredevil though.
Wonder Woman was cool. I would watch a Wonder Woman before I would another Superman movie.
Speaking of Superman, why does he have to be in a love story every movie? The world is getting blown up and his dropping "I love you"s. It's stupid. I was pulling hard for Affleck in this one. Superman has too many powers and in no imaginary world could Batman beat Superman.
With all these complaints, I still had fun. It's a decent flick.
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Affleck was one of my favorite Batmans. He is pissed! I dig it. I loved Daredevil though.
I was with you till the end. You are alone on this talk of Daredevil lol That one was awful.
Wonder Woman was cool. I would watch a Wonder Woman before I would another Superman movie.
Well you are getting your wish with the Wonder Woman movie coming out next year. I'm generally more interested in the movie now that I know she seems to generally do well in BvS.
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^ He's not alone. Daredevil was great.
****SPOILERS AHEAD****
I saw BvS yesterday. I enjoyed it. It had some epic fight scenes. And gave a lot of easter eggs to the fans. Fantastic movie for a longtime DC fan!
But at the same time, I can see why a lot of people didn't like it. It's such a dark movie. It really could have used a little bit of comedy relief. I think the only thing we got is when Batman said, "Oh shit." when Doomsday was coming at him.
One big plot-hole I saw is when Lois went after the Kryptonite spear. Batman, Wonder Woman and Superman were talking about how Doomsday was grown from Kryptonian tissue and Kryptonite could kill him if it pierced his skin...but Lois wasn't there. So how did she know that?
Another thing me and my dad were wondering: When Batman has the dream of the guy warning him of Superman, it looks to be the Flash. But in the dream, he looks like he's a black guy. In the footage that was stolen from Luthor, Flash looks hispanic. So was that Flash in his dream?
How cool was Wonder Woman?
And who thought that Superman was going to die? That was a shocker!
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http://batman-news.com/2016/03/27/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend/ (http://batman-news.com/2016/03/27/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend/)
Ha! Suck it critics! No one cares what you think. #1 opening superhero movie of all-time!
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http://batman-news.com/2016/03/27/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend/ (http://batman-news.com/2016/03/27/batman-v-superman-opening-weekend/)
Ha! Suck it critics! No one cares what you think. #1 opening superhero of all-time!
It's deserving of its criticism with the problems it has, but I'm glad it did well because I hope they can then push to do better with the next movies. They can make Wonder Woman better, hopefully not make too many mistakes with Justice League. Maybe we'll get the Batman movie sooner than later because it seems like Batman is considered the best aspect of the movie lol
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Speaking of Superman, why does he have to be in a love story every movie? The world is getting blown up and his dropping "I love you"s. It's stupid. I was pulling hard for Affleck in this one. Superman has too many powers and in no imaginary world could Batman beat Superman.
ya that kinda annoyed me too... i was like really!?
^ He's not alone. Daredevil was great.
****SPOILERS AHEAD****
One big plot-hole I saw is when Lois went after the Kryptonite spear. Batman, Wonder Woman and Superman were talking about how Doomsday was grown from Kryptonian tissue and Kryptonite could kill him if it pierced his skin...but Lois wasn't there. So how did she know that?
Another thing me and my dad were wondering: When Batman has the dream of the guy warning him of Superman, it looks to be the Flash. But in the dream, he looks like he's a black guy. In the footage that was stolen from Luthor, Flash looks hispanic. So was that Flash in his dream?
****SPOILERS AHEAD****
Dude, first thing i said after the movie was,, how the hell did Lois know to go for the spear. Like you said, she was no where near the location and no one told her about its weakness.... ANd I am not the type of person to look for plot holes, so that tells you how big of a plot hole that was.
As for Flash, also noticed that..... he looked light skin to me with facial hair. hard to tell though. (during the dream). But cant flash time travel if he runs fast enough? (not a comic book fan here). So it could be a future flash, if he indeed that was him.
Also, Aquaman looked awesome
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You are alone on this talk of Daredevil lol That one was awful.
Really? I loved season one of Daredevil but season 2 surpassed it by a country mile. I thought it was fantastic. Great story arcs and characters. Punisher and Elektra were great additions to an already great show. Maybe you mean the old Ben Affleck/ Jennifer Garner Daredevil movie? If not I couldn't disagree with you more if I wanted to.
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You are alone on this talk of Daredevil lol That one was awful.
Really? I loved season one of Daredevil but season 2 surpassed it by a country mile. I thought it was fantastic. Great story arcs and characters. Punisher and Elektra were great additions to an already great show. Maybe you mean the old Ben Affleck/ Jennifer Garner Daredevil movie? If not I couldn't disagree with you more if I wanted to.
Yeah I was talking about the trash Daredevil movie. The show is fantastic. I don't get how anyone can find that movie to be watchable lol I think the only redeeming aspect of that was just having Michael Clarke Duncan in it as Kingpin, cause it's Michael Clarke Duncan.
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Yeah I was talking about the trash Daredevil movie. The show is fantastic. I don't get how anyone can find that movie to be watchable lol I think the only redeeming aspect of that was just having Michael Clarke Duncan in it as Kingpin, cause it's Michael Clarke Duncan.
I was talking about the movie too. I loved it. I liked the Thomas Jane as Punisher movie too.
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I loved the Thomas Jane Punisher, too. Both of those movies were great action flicks. I loved the popsicle scene!
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Yeah I was talking about the trash Daredevil movie. The show is fantastic. I don't get how anyone can find that movie to be watchable lol I think the only redeeming aspect of that was just having Michael Clarke Duncan in it as Kingpin, cause it's Michael Clarke Duncan.
I was talking about the movie too. I loved it. I liked the Thomas Jane as Punisher movie too.
I didn't think the Daredevil movie was terrible. Certainly not the best out there, but far from the worst. I just watched the Punisher (Thomas Jane version) a couple of days ago. It's pretty entertaining. I like how he destroys John Travolta's life, then pops a cap in his ass, ties him to the bumper of a car and he gets drug along, finally catching fire and screaming, then the big explosion.
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I have to ask the comic collectors out there, what the hell is going on with Marvel and DC? Most of their stuff has been renumbered yet again and the respective universes keep undergoing major realignments. Marvel's don't seem as bad, but DC just keeps on with do-overs that never "fix" whatever it is they are trying to fix.
My next big issue is with both companies putting crappy artists on their books. I used to laugh at the art of guys like Mike Alred and Frank Quitely, but now it seems crap art like that is in demand. What happened to the Silvestri's and Lee's of the four-color funnies? A huge chunk of the comics out there now look like ass IMO.
Then I noticed DC soliciting damn near every single book with an alternate John Romita Jr. cover. I have to ask, why? I've thought that guy's art sucked since back in the 80's. He regularly made Spider-Man look like a buffed-up, square-muscled freak. I put his crappy art on the same playing field as Rob Liefeld in the suck department. And wouldn't you know...old Liefeld gets just about as much cover art duties. You can't browse a comic rack without seeing some guy with no feet, tiny thumbs, shoulder pads, 1 billion pouches and a grimace like he's shitting a brick...all surrounded by disembodied heads similarly constipated or making the "O" orgasm face.
Next up, why the hell did Todd McFarlane feel it appropriate to put the sucktastic Erik Larsen on Spawn penciling duties? Spawn faded into mediocrity years ago, but seeing Larsen's lame-ass artwork on the cover makes me feel bad for Spawn. I didn't feel as bad for Spawn about getting killed and his old lady remarrying his bestest buddie as I do about seeing him ravaged by Erik Larsen's gnarly pencils.
Other little things I have noticed are an abundance of nudy-cover variants for independent publishers and Marvel must being using a roulette wheel to come up with names for their relaunched books. Uncanny Avengers? Ugh...this all just makes my head hurt. At least these guys haven't gone and done something super regrettable like turning Thor into a chick or making Doctor Octopus the new Spider-Man.....oh wait....damn. :'(
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I have to ask the comic collectors out there, what the hell is going on with Marvel and DC? Most of their stuff has been renumbered yet again and the respective universes keep undergoing major realignments. Marvel's don't seem as bad, but DC just keeps on with do-overs that never "fix" whatever it is they are trying to fix.
The New 52 from DC came about because they wanted to "freshen up" the line, allowing them to reinvent themselves for a more diverse audience. It was also in reaction to Disney acquiring both Marvel and the Star Wars franchise a few years earlier. I did NOT care for them dropping the numbering on tenured books like Action and Detective Comics but they decided that they needed a clean break from what they were doing and that meant all books got new number #1's...no exceptions. >:(
Anyway, for the first year or so seemed to be a big enough success that Marvel aped the concept and introduced the whole "Marvel NOW" relaunch. It was meant to steal DC's thunder from the New 52 as well as helping them deal with the fact that they weren't getting the ROI they wanted for dealing with Sony & Fox on the Spider-Man, FF, and X-Men related movies. You mentioned books like Uncanny Avengers as being a contrived title but it was actually a smart legal move on Marvel's part in that it denied Fox the ability to use the stories to be made into movies since the X characters were intertwined with the Avengers. As time went on, it became more obvious that Marvel wanted to get out of the deals they had with both Fox and Sony so things like mixing X-Men with Avengers on one team, hyping up the Inhumans over Mutants and discontinuing the FF in their own book was deemed necessary. You can see other things taking shape like them focusing more on characters like Spider-Gwen and Miles Morales instead of Peter Parker for a while there.
As far as renumbering goes...it's partly due to people getting excited over the concept of the #1 issue and both companies view that high numbered books tend to scare away potential new readers (which is almost to say to hell with the existing readership). In DC's case for the New 52 it did make sense that they were renumbering their entire line to appear more cohesive (which wasn't exactly the case) but for Marvel, they kept hitting the reset button to keep getting that spike in sales, volume numbers be damned. :P At least with this latest streamline attempt with DC's Rebirth, they're going back to the legacy numbering on books like Action Comics and Detective Comics even though it's not completely fixed in that the New 52 issues count towards the totals and a book like Action will resume around the 950's instead of at 905 (the first volume ended at 904). I would have preferred they reinstated legacy numbering to books like Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman as well (along with bringing back Adventure Comics) but I guess I should settle for the fact that I should see Action Comics #1000 in my lifetime. :)
My next big issue is with both companies putting crappy artists on their books. I used to laugh at the art of guys like Mike Alred and Frank Quitely, but now it seems crap art like that is in demand. What happened to the Silvestri's and Lee's of the four-color funnies? A huge chunk of the comics out there now look like ass IMO.
Then I noticed DC soliciting damn near every single book with an alternate John Romita Jr. cover. I have to ask, why? I've thought that guy's art sucked since back in the 80's. He regularly made Spider-Man look like a buffed-up, square-muscled freak. I put his crappy art on the same playing field as Rob Liefeld in the suck department. And wouldn't you know...old Liefeld gets just about as much cover art duties. You can't browse a comic rack without seeing some guy with no feet, tiny thumbs, shoulder pads, 1 billion pouches and a grimace like he's shitting a brick...all surrounded by disembodied heads similarly constipated or making the "O" orgasm face.
I don't like Mike Allred on mainstream stuff but his style fit a book such as Madman like a glove. I haven't much cared for Quietly's artwork but it worked for All-Star Superman. I don't follow Top Cow so I don't know if Silvestri is still producing artwork or not but I know Lee is more behind the scenes now since selling Wildstorm to DC and becoming co-Publisher with Didio. He still draws covers and as much as I like his art, it's starting to feel a little dated to me.
As for Romita Jr., I used to utterly despise his artwork back in the day. He did do a crossover book with Punisher/Wolverine/Ghost Rider that I enjoyed the look of and I really liked his effort on Punisher/Batman that I wasn't as aggravated by his art. I get what you're saying about it looking boxy and what not but let's not fool ourselves, it's still leagues better than anything Liefeld has ever done. :P
Next up, why the hell did Todd McFarlane feel it appropriate to put the sucktastic Erik Larsen on Spawn penciling duties? Spawn faded into mediocrity years ago, but seeing Larsen's lame-ass artwork on the cover makes me feel bad for Spawn. I didn't feel as bad for Spawn about getting killed and his old lady remarrying his bestest buddie as I do about seeing him ravaged by Erik Larsen's gnarly pencils.
I dropped both Spawn and The Savage Dragon around the same time and eventually quit collecting comics for most the late 90's and early 2000's. I was suffering serious burn out from Image and the stuff coming out of DC and Marvel at the time was NOT stuff I gave a crap about. I'm surprised Spawn is still going at this point and I'm just as surprised as you that McFarlane would let Larsen work on pencils. I used to enjoy The Savage Dragon for the first couple of years until the wheels fell off. Oh well, I figure McFarlane is still too busy making toys. :P
Other little things I have noticed are an abundance of nudy-cover variants for independent publishers and Marvel must being using a roulette wheel to come up with names for their relaunched books. Uncanny Avengers? Ugh...this all just makes my head hurt. At least these guys haven't gone and done something super regrettable like turning Thor into a chick or making Doctor Octopus the new Spider-Man.....oh wait....damn. :'(
They're between movies so this gives them time to mess with things like make Sam Wilson Cap and have Thor be a woman. They've done worse in the past like making Tony Stark a teenager and the whole Heroes Reborn thing. Steve Rogers should be back as Cap here shortly and Jane Foster will stop being Thor once the Thor: Ragnarok movie rolls around. Like I mentioned before, Uncanny Avengers is them using the characters to sell books but mixing them with Fox prohibited properties. I don't know if UA is even still going or not since I don't buy Marvel (though I've been sorely tempted to pick up Spider-Woman as she's always been a favorite character of mine). They're also pushing the Inhumans and if I recall they just came out and said that Quicksilver/Scarlet Witch aren't mutants nor are they Magneto's kids but Inhumans instead. :-X
In regards to independents, the only "nude" stuff I see comes from companies like Zenoscope who do the Grimm's Fairy Tales stuff. It all looks super cheesecake to me but apparently it sells. ??? The only indie stuff I keep up with anymore is the Hellboy/Mignola-verse stuff from Dark Horse and Valiant. I'd count Astro City from Vertigo but that's a DC banner so that doesn't really count. ;)
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BvS spoilers of course...
I just realized something that was pointed out to me, that makes the plot kinda suck a little more. It's something I forgot after I left the movie, but not only is this a terrible Lex Luthor, but this awful Lex Luthor, right off the bat, knows exactly who Superman is and very clearly knows who The Flash is or I'm sure he could figure out who that is. It's less of a big deal that he knows Wonder Woman, Cyborg, and Aquaman right away to some degree, but he technically can know the background of Cyborg no problem, and he can very easily keep track of Wonder Woman. The cameos were already poorly used in the movie other than Wonder Woman, but this kinda stuff just shows how badly written this movie is. It's just a lot of crap that didn't need to be in this movie and I worry the three hour cut will make things worse as apparently they removed like an important connectin character for the Justice League leadup from the theatrical cut and is a deleted scene now.
Only good thing that might come out of this is that Warner might be panicking right now as they try to likely movie up the Batman movie. They screwed up and now have to figure out a way to do this right to make up for their problems. I hope that means firing Snyder from all movies, hope that Suicide Squad is good (I'm hearing it could be, since it wasn't directed by Snyder or written by the guy who did BvS) and hope they are handling Wonder Woman right.
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Awesome reply Flashback...thank you!
I get that DC and Marvel wanted to relaunch their books with #1 issues because traditionally, a #1 with "Collector's item first issue!" slapped on the cover always sells better than some random numbered issue. But they have both done it multiple times now. Even worse, I honestly remember reading Fantastic Four and other comics that had dual-numbering on them. That is, what the issue actually was in sequential order as well as the "new" numbering. :o The heroes reborn stuff could have been a storyline running through those core books with the Onslaught bookends, but instead they renumbered all of them. And at this point, I have to point out Liefeld's worst cover ever was in the Heroes Reborn debacle.
(http://img2.rnkr-static.com/user_node_img/50006/1000115285/870/honorable-mention-photo-u1.jpg)
I guess I truly did "move on" from mainstream comics almost ten years ago. I've recently been lured back because of the new Star Wars comics which seem to have some of the best artists (in my opinion at least) in the industry working on them. Marvel and Disney have been giving the Star Wars books the royal treatment with great artists like John Cassady, Phil Noto, Salvador Larocca, Phil Jiminez and others the reigns.
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^ Everyone loves to use that image. ...the image that was rejected and never actually printed. Every artist, even your Jim Lees and John Byrnes, have rejected pieces that aren't up to par.
Liefeld is like the Ben Affleck of the comic world. It's just so cool to hate on him.
Check this out, there's a reason Liefeld can still get mainstream work to this day from the big two:
(http://i.newsarama.com/images/i/000/075/807/original/hkdv_cv1_r3ign84sdmd_02.jpg?1364138709)
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I hate the constant relaunches, too. And this summer, DC is doing it AGAIN with the DC Rebirth line that's coming.
DC's New 52 hasn't been so bad. I've at least followed the Green Lantern books. But Marvel Now is just terribly bad. I don't even recognize most of the Marvel Universe anymore. And everything comes off as so goofy and silly that I can't take a bit of it seriously.
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^ Everyone loves to use that image. ...the image that was rejected and never actually printed. Every artist, even your Jim Lees and John Byrnes, have rejected pieces that aren't up to par.
Liefeld is like the Ben Affleck of the comic world. It's just so cool to hate on him.
Check this out, there's a reason Liefeld can still get mainstream work to this day from the big two:
(http://i.newsarama.com/images/i/000/075/807/original/hkdv_cv1_r3ign84sdmd_02.jpg?1364138709)
It's been a minute (or a few years) since I owned the Heroes Reborn books...but I'm pretty sure it was an actual cover.
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^ Everyone loves to use that image. ...the image that was rejected and never actually printed. Every artist, even your Jim Lees and John Byrnes, have rejected pieces that aren't up to par.
Liefeld is like the Ben Affleck of the comic world. It's just so cool to hate on him.
Check this out, there's a reason Liefeld can still get mainstream work to this day from the big two:
(http://i.newsarama.com/images/i/000/075/807/original/hkdv_cv1_r3ign84sdmd_02.jpg?1364138709)
I don't think it's cool just to bag on someone "just because." Liefeld's art sucks. It's sucked for a very long time. My best friend Ralph and I used to just cringe when we saw the newest comic with a Liefeld cover on it. As far as him still getting work from Marvel and DC....I just chalk it up to they will pay anyone that can draw a stick figure. Looking through the newest Previews catalogs, a huge majority of comic art has turned to pure $hit. And here are some Liefeld "classics" to illustrate his greatness.
Brigade. No feet. Disembodied heads. No background, just white. He didn't even finish penciling his thighs...it's just zig-zag scribbles!
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/02/BrigadeComics1.jpg/250px-BrigadeComics1.jpg)
Chicks with triple-Z boobs jutting straight from their necks. Thong bikinis and the giant chick wearing a 1st grader sized skirt. And look at those thin waistlines!
(http://img1.rnkr-static.com/user_node_img/50006/1000115275/870/wasp-women-photo-u1.jpg)
True Liefeld classic here. Cable's enormous gun isn't even built straight and looks like the muzzle is a rotating camera eye. His head is smaller than his hands that are - in classic Liefeld style - hidden behind his gun. Pouches weren't going to cut it with this beefcake, so Liefeld strapped the single biggest pouch imaginable on his back. Look at it! It's as big as a pop up camper!
(http://img3.rnkr-static.com/user_node_img/50006/1000115280/870/yaaaaaaaaahhhhh-photo-u1.jpg)
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No, the giant chest is a rejected piece. It's well-known because that's almost always the piece that people use for an example when talking trash about Liefeld. Notice there is no logo, dialogue, or text of any kind except for his signature.
And despite what haters say, his artwork not only sold a lot of books, it broke sales records. So obviously people enjoyed his work.
Here's the entire Heroes Reborn Captain America cover gallery:
http://comicvine.gamespot.com/captain-america/4050-5776/
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Like Liefeld is the only artist guilty of drawing lots of pouches, bad girls, and big guns in the 90s. That's what was cool back then in comics.
But yeah, the feet thing is something that's known, and Liefeld even admits to being bad at drawing feet. So often, he said that he just hides the feet behind something so he doesn't have to deal with it.
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Sam Keith...YUCK! He's got to be the worst artist to come from the 90s. 50 times worse than Liefeld could ever be:
(http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldatabase/images/7/7b/Marvel_Comics_Presents_Vol_1_94.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20080411222551)
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No, the giant chest is a rejected piece. It's well-known because that's almost always the piece that people use for an example when talking trash about Liefeld. Notice there is no logo, dialogue, or text of any kind except for his signature.
And despite what haters say, his artwork not only sold a lot of books, it broke sales records. So obviously people enjoyed his work.
Here's the entire Heroes Reborn Captain America cover gallery:
http://comicvine.gamespot.com/captain-america/4050-5776/
It wasn't rejected because it was printed in one form or another. It may not have been on a retail cover of an actual issue of Captain America, but it was printed in galleries, Previews solicitations, etc.
Liefeld helped X-Force #1 reach a sales milestone off the back of Jim Lee on X-Men. Marvel reinvigorated the New Mutants as X-Force and Jim Lee got his own brand-new X-Men comic. I remember Liefeld doing Lee Jeans (I believe it was Lee, maybe Levi's) commercials at this time as well.
But even the most ardent Liefeld supporter has to admit that his art went from dyamic yet unrealistic to downright ridiculous. He is absolutely ridiculous. Extreme comics! Maximum comics! Awesome comics! "Gurgle....no arrows!" The first issue of Youngblood was a completely ridiculous, hot mess.
Liefeld's art is akin to dog excrement when comparing him to his contemporaries like Jim Lee, Wilce Portacio, Marc Silvestri and Todd McFarlane. Even Erik Larsen's ridiculous art seems to pop off the page and look good compared to Liefeld.
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No, rejected means it wasn't printed. It's on the internet, yeah, but it's not in a comic.
And Liefeld was already working with the X-Force team before they officially became X-Force. He was the penciller on New Mutants (where the team came from), and in that run before X-Force ever launched he created both Cable and Deadpool.
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Like Liefeld is the only artist guilty of drawing lots of pouches, bad girls, and big guns in the 90s. That's what was cool back then in comics.
But yeah, the feet thing is something that's known, and Liefeld even admits to being bad at drawing feet. So often, he said that he just hides the feet behind something so he doesn't have to deal with it.
Dude...the only other artists drawing bazillions of pouches like Liefeld were his "Xtreme", "Awesome" and "Maximum" flunkies. I wasn't pointing out his drawing bad girls, I was pointing out how absolutely F'n ridiculous they look! Big guns are one thing....the retarded monstrosities that Liefeld tried to pass of for guns is just....I don't even have a world to describe how ludicrous they are.
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No, rejected means it wasn't printed. It's on the internet, yeah, but it's not in a comic.
And Liefeld was already working with the X-Force team before they officially became X-Force. He was the penciller on New Mutants (where the team came from), and in that run before X-Force ever launched he created both Cable and Deadpool.
It wasn't rejected. It was penciled. It was inked. It was colored. And I'll bet you a million bucks it found print in one form or another because during the 90's and most of the 2K's, I was a huge Marvel nerd and bought nearly every stinking comic they made. And that image damn well popped up in print in an official capacity.
As for X-Force, yes...I know Liefeld began penciling duties on New Mutants with issue #86 which also had Cable in the last panel. Once Simonson left writing duties and Nicienza took over, it went to shit. X-Force was popular sure and I enjoyed it at first, but it became more and more ridiculous.
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Seriously? In the 90s? The only one using big guns and pouches?
...do you even 90s, dude?
(http://www.supermanhomepage.com/images/characters/who-images/bloodsport2.jpg)(http://screencrave.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/x-men-bishop-570x411.jpg)(http://www.fightersgeneration.com/characters/cable-fixx.jpg)(http://static3.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/1/17809/348876-107313-scarlet-spider.jpg)
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If you can find a comic with that Captain America image, I will concede...but you won't.
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Sam Keith...YUCK! He's got to be the worst artist to come from the 90s. 50 times worse than Liefeld could ever be:
(http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldatabase/images/7/7b/Marvel_Comics_Presents_Vol_1_94.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20080411222551)
Sam Kieth has a stylized art that works for what he does. I found it quite enjoyable, certainly more than Liefeld's garbage.
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If you can find a comic with that Captain America image, I will concede...but you won't.
Again, I didn't say it was necessarily in a comic book per se. It saw print in some fashion because I held it in my hand. Whether that was a pin-up art piece, a promotional image for Heroes Reborn in a catalog or whatever, it was printed on really-real paper in that time period. I can't look it up here at work, but I will provide the proof when I can get on unrestricted internet.
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Maybe in an issue of Wizard Magazine or something similar where they got a hold of it? Not in a Marvel Comic.
And it was made for Heroes Reborn, and wasn't printed in the comic because it was a bad piece.
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Seriously? In the 90s? The only one using big guns and pouches?
...do you even 90s, dude?
(http://www.supermanhomepage.com/images/characters/who-images/bloodsport2.jpg)(http://screencrave.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/x-men-bishop-570x411.jpg)(http://www.fightersgeneration.com/characters/cable-fixx.jpg)(http://static3.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/1/17809/348876-107313-scarlet-spider.jpg)
Well of course pouches were the "in" thing in the 90's. But did any single character not under the Liefeld umbrella have a tenth as many pouches as Liefeld works?
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^ Like the entire early 90s team of X-Men. All kinds of yellow belts and pouches in places where belts really don't belong.
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Funnily enough, someone on my comic group on Facebook just posted this forgotten about costume of Polaris's (from X-Factor) that fits right into that theme:
(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtf1/v/t1.0-9/12718307_10156767827505451_3249026331929642570_n.jpg?oh=ec71a1b38fed372144e8f64b800fb3c3&oe=5791A31A)
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Funnily enough, someone on my comic group on Facebook just posted this forgotten about costume of Polaris's (from X-Factor) that fits right into that theme:
(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtf1/v/t1.0-9/12718307_10156767827505451_3249026331929642570_n.jpg?oh=ec71a1b38fed372144e8f64b800fb3c3&oe=5791A31A)
Is that Mike Deodato Jr. artwork? I don't quite understand why Polaris is standing on her tipsy-toes. :P
That's a pretty tawdry looking costume overall. Then again, Polaris has never had the best of luck in the costume department. :-\