General and Gaming => Classic Video Games => Topic started by: patrickmeansly on May 01, 2013, 03:13:58 pm
Title: Game value and rarity!
Post by: patrickmeansly on May 01, 2013, 03:13:58 pm
we all know that some games are rare and expensive and some are not rare and still expensive. examples: earthbound snes, flintstones nes, etc. Over the next 20 to 30 years, do you guys expect that value of retro games to stay the same, go way up, or go down???? Maybe some games that are 200 dollars maybe in the thousands??? I'm just curious of your thoughts. Thanks for your time.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: htimreimer on May 01, 2013, 03:58:09 pm
that a hard question to answer because video game collecting is still in its infancy and because of it infancy, prices go up and down every day and nothing gets established
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: insektmute on May 01, 2013, 04:13:10 pm
I think it's too broad of a question. There are some games that will always be cheap, some that will fluctuate, and some that will always sell for obscene amounts. Original print run, platform, version differences, all this stuff can have an impact, even if a re-release is subjectively "better" than the original.
I think the only area where we'll see a more strict dividing line is with hardware breaking down over time, and limiting the number of reliable units around, but we're a long way off from that.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: ffxik on May 01, 2013, 04:14:06 pm
With any collectors markets there will be an ebb and flow in prices, As of right now people are finally getting sick of the sky high prices. We may see some ebb happening in the near future. I don't know if games will get as high as you are speculating, but it's something to keep an eye on.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: sin2beta on May 01, 2013, 04:36:27 pm
I will take the opposite opinion and say that prices will stabilize as time goes on. Fluctuation, although always present, will become virtually unnoticeable. John "Gamester81" does a series of fantastic interviews with the Joe, owner of atari2600.com. In fact, the latest episode talked specifically about pricing. He mentions that most of the old games have stabilized in prices. He just started carrying NES stuff and those prices fluctuate a lot more right now.
Now even the atari 2600 has some rare games that sell for very little. But it also has games that sell for insane amounts. But the prices are fairly constant.
For current stuff, I imagine the only games that will sell for ridiculous amounts are rare AND good games. Panzer Dragoon Saga and Snatcher come to mind. Panzer Dragoon Saga will become much more expensive is my guess due to only being on the saturn. Also, it seems that finding it on virtual console or XBLA will be slim due to various things like "losing the source code".
Here is the Joe interview
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: sin2beta on May 01, 2013, 04:45:22 pm
some are not rare and still expensive. examples: earthbound snes, flintstones nes, etc
Flintstones has two releases. One is common and cheap. One is very rare (blockbuster rental exclusive) and very expensive. At least this is my understanding. It's just dinosaur peak that is expensive. Is there another one? Or am I confused? I'm not a Nintendo collector... so...
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: soera on May 01, 2013, 04:54:53 pm
Yeah its dino peak thats expensive. Im not too sure its a BB rental only game as it was advertised in Nintendo power quite a bit ... but it was a weirdly timed release (really late in the systems life a full 3 years after the SNES was live in US (August of 94 for the game vs August of 91 for the SNES).
The price of games will forever fluctuate. The one thing that is consistent in game collecting is that the variables will continue to change whether it be people selling out, people getting in, people finding multiple copies of something, copies of other stuff getting into a permanent collection, etc.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: patrickmeansly on May 01, 2013, 08:10:39 pm
I think it's too broad of a question. There are some games that will always be cheap, some that will fluctuate, and some that will always sell for obscene amounts. Original print run, platform, version differences, all this stuff can have an impact, even if a re-release is subjectively "better" than the original.
I think the only area where we'll see a more strict dividing line is with hardware breaking down over time, and limiting the number of reliable units around, but we're a long way off from that.
When you say hardware breaking down, are you referring to the actual retro consoles eventually not working and not being able to be replaced???
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: patrickmeansly on May 01, 2013, 08:11:55 pm
I will take the opposite opinion and say that prices will stabilize as time goes on. Fluctuation, although always present, will become virtually unnoticeable. John "Gamester81" does a series of fantastic interviews with the Joe, owner of atari2600.com. In fact, the latest episode talked specifically about pricing. He mentions that most of the old games have stabilized in prices. He just started carrying NES stuff and those prices fluctuate a lot more right now.
Now even the atari 2600 has some rare games that sell for very little. But it also has games that sell for insane amounts. But the prices are fairly constant.
For current stuff, I imagine the only games that will sell for ridiculous amounts are rare AND good games. Panzer Dragoon Saga and Snatcher come to mind. Panzer Dragoon Saga will become much more expensive is my guess due to only being on the saturn. Also, it seems that finding it on virtual console or XBLA will be slim due to various things like "losing the source code".
Here is the Joe interview
Excellent video!! Appreciate the link! Very educational. Per Panzer Dragoon Saga, I'm saving up for that one now lol. I know I gotta save about 500
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: kingrat101 on May 01, 2013, 08:39:42 pm
I think prices for these games that are in demand will stay about the same. With all games eventually becoming digital, I think the prices will go down slightly however there will always be a market out there that want the original retail release. A perfect example is Radiant Silvergun, I remember looking for it before it was released on PSN and Xbox live and it was at least in the $250 range, however now with those releases it hovers around the 180 range. Still expensive but not ridiculous
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: sin2beta on May 01, 2013, 09:57:51 pm
Yeah its dino peak thats expensive. Im not too sure its a BB rental only game as it was advertised in Nintendo power quite a bit ... but it was a weirdly timed release (really late in the systems life a full 3 years after the SNES was live in US (August of 94 for the game vs August of 91 for the SNES).
The price of games will forever fluctuate. The one thing that is consistent in game collecting is that the variables will continue to change whether it be people selling out, people getting in, people finding multiple copies of something, copies of other stuff getting into a permanent collection, etc.
It was blockbuster only. That much I am sure of.
Anyone see the game chasers episode where they find adventures at dinosaur peak at Game X Change for $5 (The Dino and Hoppy price)?
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: soera on May 02, 2013, 12:19:15 am
As far as those videos go, I think alot of them are staged. Im sure its possible to find that ... but the chances are pretty insanely slim and there are loads of videos buy people with ridiculous scores. So many of them that it makes their stories a lot less believable.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: sin2beta on May 02, 2013, 12:38:08 am
So, according to that thread, some think it is BB exclusive some think it is a rumor to increase the rarity idea? It would be interesting as a few people suggested and try to find some adverts showing it other places. I think that would be the way to go as being in NP makes sense just because it is licensed. That's what the magazine does. But that's an interesting topic.
As for game chasers, it is possible it is staged. The only thing is that almost everything they find is not that spectacular at all. Of everything I've seen Flintstones is the only amazing find. Everything else is more along the lines of Faxanadu for $2. I'm inclined to believe it's legit. Especially since most of those places are basically in our backyard and are portrayed very accurately for when I visit the locations. One of the reasons I like the show is if I see some place interesting, I can visit it on a road trip!
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: insektmute on May 02, 2013, 01:13:02 am
When you say hardware breaking down, are you referring to the actual retro consoles eventually not working and not being able to be replaced???
More or less. This is more an issue with CD-based systems than cartridges, but eventually, supplies of laser assemblies will dwindle. Most electronics use variations of really only a fairly small number of models from a few different companies, and in the case of Philips, they ceased manufacturing that stuff entirely - it's already an issue in some cases with old CD players. So even if a particular system shipped tons and tons of units, repair parts are often being plucked at for use with dozens of other devices, too.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: sin2beta on May 02, 2013, 01:28:44 am
Yeah, CD systems will reach a point where they just don't work anymore. Lasers burn out after so many hours of use. Even the CDs themselves will stop working. Really old laserdiscs (notoriously the discovision run) suffer from disc rot. CDs are a data encoded label put on a plastic disc. The adhesive on this either starts to go away or reacts with the data label. Either way they'll stop working. Honestly, though, this is a LONG time from now. We are starting to see laser rot on SOME discs from the late 70s. Since then the technology has gotten better as well.
My solution. Buy a house with a doomsday bunker and fill it with sega saturn and dreamcast lasers.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: brunauss on May 02, 2013, 01:29:39 am
Don't know about actual market value, but bidding amounts seem to keep going up. Bidding for a Tengen Nintendo cartridge Tetris soared recently past $300 on GameGavel.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: ffxik on May 02, 2013, 01:52:07 am
I think it's too broad of a question. There are some games that will always be cheap, some that will fluctuate, and some that will always sell for obscene amounts. Original print run, platform, version differences, all this stuff can have an impact, even if a re-release is subjectively "better" than the original.
I think the only area where we'll see a more strict dividing line is with hardware breaking down over time, and limiting the number of reliable units around, but we're a long way off from that.
When you say hardware breaking down, are you referring to the actual retro consoles eventually not working and not being able to be replaced???
Pretty much, yes.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: blipcs76 on May 02, 2013, 11:01:49 am
I'm seeing prices continue to soar, not stabilize. Especially NES stuff, which is the focus of my collection and especially CIB/complete games. I've seen CIB Gargoyle's Quest 2 sell for over $200, Metal Storm and Bucky O Hare for well over $100, Castlevania for over $75, etc.
The rarest games seem to seem to have doubled in the past two years. Little Samson has jumped from about $120 two years ago to almost $500 now. Others like Flinstones Dinosaur Peak have also tripled to over $500.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: sin2beta on May 02, 2013, 11:20:37 am
It's based on the age of the system. Right now, collect for gamecube and xbox. The previous generation is always treated like trash. The amount of XBox games you can find for $1 is amazing. The wii, 360, and PS3 are getting there as well. Give it a year or 2 into the next generation.
The N64 era is just starting to separate into rare uncommon and common games. But it still isn't clearly defined yet what is rare or common.
The SNES era knows what is common and such but is now figuring out the prices.
The NES era is really close to stabilized in my opinion. The gap between the expensive and cheap games will widen more though.
The Atari era is pretty much stabilized.
This is how I see it at least.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: darko on May 02, 2013, 12:06:00 pm
It's based on the age of the system. Right now, collect for gamecube and xbox. The previous generation is always treated like trash. The amount of XBox games you can find for $1 is amazing. The wii, 360, and PS3 are getting there as well. Give it a year or 2 into the next generation.
The N64 era is just starting to separate into rare uncommon and common games. But it still isn't clearly defined yet what is rare or common.
The SNES era knows what is common and such but is now figuring out the prices.
The NES era is really close to stabilized in my opinion. The gap between the expensive and cheap games will widen more though.
The Atari era is pretty much stabilized.
This is how I see it at least.
I basically agree with this. There will always be expensive titles for each system (if based on nothing more than rarity). I don't see game collecting popping completely like comic books or devaluing to nothing like a LOT of sports cards. For that to happen I think gaming in general would have to lose it's presence as a legitimate form of entertainment. I don't think that's a threat as long as Gen-Y is around.
SNES prices are absolutely going through a pricing phase just like the NES did several years ago. Hagane is a really, really good example of what's going on in the SNES realm. 18 months ago you could pick it up cart only for ~ $80-100, now it's $200+ (and up to $700 complete). Will that pricing structure last? Not in my opinion. As more of the "serious" collectors get their hands on copies at these prices, demand will drop back down to reality. Will we ever see Hagane with a fair market value of $80 again? Probably not, but I could see the cart going for $125-150 in a year or so.
Just today I completed my Conker's Bad Fur Day (finally found a good manual). I think those of you out there looking to collect for the N64 need to jump on that sooner rather than later. This fall/winter (before Christmas) will likely prove the most expensive time to collect for the system in it's history - depending on what games you're looking for.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: turf on May 02, 2013, 01:30:53 pm
I think those of you out there looking to collect for the N64 need to jump on that sooner rather than later. This fall/winter (before Christmas) will likely prove the most expensive time to collect for the system in it's history - depending on what games you're looking for.
I have a question about N64 collecting. Clay Fighter: Sculpter's Cut is closing in on being a $200 game. It was a Blockbuster exclusive. It is expensive as hell. Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine was exclusive to Blockbuster and LucasArts Store. Yet, it is less than $20. Neither is a good game. Someone give me a reason for this.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: insektmute on May 02, 2013, 01:59:54 pm
Yeah, CD systems will reach a point where they just don't work anymore. Lasers burn out after so many hours of use. Even the CDs themselves will stop working. Really old laserdiscs (notoriously the discovision run) suffer from disc rot. CDs are a data encoded label put on a plastic disc. The adhesive on this either starts to go away or reacts with the data label. Either way they'll stop working. Honestly, though, this is a LONG time from now. We are starting to see laser rot on SOME discs from the late 70s. Since then the technology has gotten better as well.
My solution. Buy a house with a doomsday bunker and fill it with sega saturn and dreamcast lasers.
Yeah, disc rot is a HUGE problem that's more widespread than the industry would like to let on, and it seems especially prevalent with CD-Rs manufactured in the late '90s/early '00s.
I actually ran into this with my physical copy of the Witcher 2, too. The discs never worked quite right to begin with (long story), but last time I tried to use them, there were very visible signs of disc rot going on, and they're effectively unusable now. CDP stepped up and offered everyone free copies of the game on GOG, which is great, but they really didn't acknowledge or take any accountability for the problem.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: brunauss on May 02, 2013, 02:07:36 pm
I think those of you out there looking to collect for the N64 need to jump on that sooner rather than later. This fall/winter (before Christmas) will likely prove the most expensive time to collect for the system in it's history - depending on what games you're looking for.
I have a question about N64 collecting. Clay Fighter: Sculpter's Cut is closing in on being a $200 game. It was a Blockbuster exclusive. It is expensive as hell. Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine was exclusive to Blockbuster and LucasArts Store. Yet, it is less than $20. Neither is a good game. Someone give me a reason for this.
Simple marketing. Clay Fighter hit that novelty sweet spot just right and Indiana Jones was an already established franchise.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: soera on May 02, 2013, 02:45:50 pm
I think it has to do with the hype of the game. If Indiana Jones had that hype (I havent even heard of that game personally) it may be in the same boat as Scupltor's cut.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: torvez on May 02, 2013, 03:37:20 pm
Yeah its dino peak thats expensive. Im not too sure its a BB rental only game as it was advertised in Nintendo power quite a bit ... but it was a weirdly timed release (really late in the systems life a full 3 years after the SNES was live in US (August of 94 for the game vs August of 91 for the SNES).
The price of games will forever fluctuate. The one thing that is consistent in game collecting is that the variables will continue to change whether it be people selling out, people getting in, people finding multiple copies of something, copies of other stuff getting into a permanent collection, etc.
It was blockbuster only. That much I am sure of.
Anyone see the game chasers episode where they find adventures at dinosaur peak at Game X Change for $5 (The Dino and Hoppy price)?
Yes! Actually, when it pops up on the bottom, it says it retails at $300. That was in 2011 (when the episode was uploaded), I don't know if they got that price on ebay or not, but now, in 2013 it goes for around $600+ on ebay. so there is some evidence that prices could definetely go up in the coming years.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: sin2beta on May 02, 2013, 04:36:04 pm
Yeah, CD systems will reach a point where they just don't work anymore. Lasers burn out after so many hours of use. Even the CDs themselves will stop working. Really old laserdiscs (notoriously the discovision run) suffer from disc rot. CDs are a data encoded label put on a plastic disc. The adhesive on this either starts to go away or reacts with the data label. Either way they'll stop working. Honestly, though, this is a LONG time from now. We are starting to see laser rot on SOME discs from the late 70s. Since then the technology has gotten better as well.
My solution. Buy a house with a doomsday bunker and fill it with sega saturn and dreamcast lasers.
Yeah, disc rot is a HUGE problem that's more widespread than the industry would like to let on, and it seems especially prevalent with CD-Rs manufactured in the late '90s/early '00s.
I actually ran into this with my physical copy of the Witcher 2, too. The discs never worked quite right to begin with (long story), but last time I tried to use them, there were very visible signs of disc rot going on, and they're effectively unusable now. CDP stepped up and offered everyone free copies of the game on GOG, which is great, but they really didn't acknowledge or take any accountability for the problem.
Yeah, CDRs do not last long. From my understanding the material of the gold reflective CDs react less and thus will last longer. But the silver color is cheaper. The green and purple of CDRs are really cheap and bad.
Title: Re: Game value and rarity!
Post by: darko on May 03, 2013, 12:43:27 am
I think those of you out there looking to collect for the N64 need to jump on that sooner rather than later. This fall/winter (before Christmas) will likely prove the most expensive time to collect for the system in it's history - depending on what games you're looking for.
I have a question about N64 collecting. Clay Fighter: Sculpter's Cut is closing in on being a $200 game. It was a Blockbuster exclusive. It is expensive as hell. Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine was exclusive to Blockbuster and LucasArts Store. Yet, it is less than $20. Neither is a good game. Someone give me a reason for this.
Simple marketing. Clay Fighter hit that novelty sweet spot just right and Indiana Jones was an already established franchise.
Sculpter's Cut is the rarest out of the Blockbuster exclusives. There were only approximately 20,000. made. It's also the second rarest N64 game in the US.