Author Topic: Why the Retron 5 Doesn't support Super GameBoy, Game Genies, or most Flashcarts  (Read 15275 times)

dashv

PRO Supporter

Folks,

I'm seeing this question a lot when people talk about the Retron 5 and there's a lot of misinformation and speculation out there that I want to put to rest. Folks talk about it being just because of piracy or because Hyperkin is too lazy. Let me tell you reality.

First lets get some general information out there.

How the Retron 5 works

The Retron 5 uses a RockChip RK3066 ARM 9 processor and runs a Hyperkin customized version of the Android Operating System.

The cartridge connectors exist for the sole purpose of dumping the cartridges rom contents to system memory where the roms are played under emulation via a Hyperkin customized version of Retroarch.

What this means:

Once the contents of the cartridges memory is dumped the game cart itself is only monitored for being present.

After the initial rom dump nothing else on the cart is actually used. Not even the SNES SFX chip. It's all being emulated on the ARM 9.

If you don't believe me...

1) turn your system on.
2) Attach an NES Game Genie to one of your nes games
3) insert the game and genie into your system
4) choose "play"
5) while playing the game unplug the cart from the game genie

You can continue to play the game for as long as you want regardless of the cart and any of it's special chips being missing.

So why does the Power Base Mini and Power Base Converter work but not the Super GameBoy, everdrive, etc. ?

Simply put the Power Base adapters allow direct access to the game ROM you want to play.

The others don't.

To better illustrate I opened my SGB and Power Base Mini:



On the outside they look quite similar. They are carts that let you plug in another cart.

But if we take a deeper look inside...



we see the Power Base Mini is a straight passthrough. No special chips. Just some re-wiring of which pins connect to what.

So the Retron 5 can see the second cart. Grab it's rom and load it into the emulator.

Looking inside the Super GameBoy is a different story...



The Super Game Boy has it's own rom. And the Retron 5 can see and download that.

But accessing the rom of the game boy game game is a different matter. Notice that the SGB has an entire GameBoy CPU onboard and a rom of it's own which does the heavy lifting and provides the Super GameBoy functionality.

Everdrives and many other flash carts are similar, often having their own roms and CPUs to add features like cheats, save states, game selection menus, etc.

These devices are far more complex than simply dumping the rom and emulating. They require constant and complex interaction between the console and the cart rather than simply dumping the rom contents. It's this extra level of cartridge interaction the current Retron 5 simply isn't designed for.

Perhaps it will change in a future update. But for now I hope this helps folks understand why <insert flashcart/special cartridge peripheral here> doesn't work.

For a complete teardown of the Retron 5 with pictures check out this link:
http://retrorgb.com/teardown.html

For more information on the RockChip that powers it's magic check out this one:
http://www.rock-chips.com/a/en/products/RK30_Series/2013/0808/312.html

Lastly, I'm not perfect and there is much I don't know. If you know for a fact that anything I've posted above is incorrect, please let me know so I can correct it.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2014, 11:35:43 am by dashv »

Why the Retron 5 Doesn't support GameBoy Color, Game Genies, or most Flashcarts
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2014, 09:34:13 am »
I think you meant Super Gameboy and not Gameboy Color in the title.

dashv

PRO Supporter

I think you meant Super Gameboy and not Gameboy Color in the title.

Right you are! It's tough writing articles on a cell phone! ;)

davifus

I think you meant Super Gameboy and not Gameboy Color in the title.

Right you are! It's tough writing articles on a cell phone! ;)

I commend your effort. I can't imagine writing all of this and linking the pictures on my phone. +1
"Hard work betrays none, but dreams betray many." ( Hachiman Hikigaya)
"People say nothing's impossible, but I do nothing everyday." (Winnie The Pooh)


burningdoom

PRO Supporter

I think you meant Super Gameboy and not Gameboy Color in the title.

Right you are! It's tough writing articles on a cell phone! ;)

I commend your effort. I can't imagine writing all of this and linking the pictures on my phone. +1

Indeed.

awesome very informative, thanks man... never type that much on your phone again lol

dashv

PRO Supporter

awesome very informative, thanks man... never type that much on your phone again lol

Tell me about it! My fingertip is so sore from tapping the screen. And you have no idea the number of autocorrects I had to, er, correct. ;)

pacpix

That was a very interesting read Dashv!  All of your information on the Retron 5 has been very thorough.  It's still too bad that you did not get to keep your Christmas tree up for the Retron 5 release :P
Currently Playing: Dark Souls: Remastered (Switch)


The Retron 5 uses RetroArch for its emulation cores and has zero real or clone hardware in it. It doesn't need to support Game Genies or flash carts because its just an emulator... They can do Game Genie and Game Shark in menu.

For those that do not know... The Super GameBoy is really a modified GameBoy designed to steal the power, video out and joypad inputs of the real SNES hardware and pump GB games directly to your screen.  The SNES is completely bypassed (except for color?)and the SGB handles everything.

So without any legit hardware to steal power or push video out it cannot work with something like a Retron 5.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 03:04:46 am by pceslayer »

dashv

PRO Supporter

The Retron 5 uses RetroArch for its emulation cores and has zero real or clone hardware in it. It doesn't need to support Game Genies or flash carts because its just an emulator... They can do Game Genie and Game Shark in menu.

For those that do not know... The Super GameBoy is really a modified GameBoy designed to steal the power, video out and joypad inputs of the real SNES hardware and pump GB games directly to your screen.  The SNES is completely bypassed (except for color?)and the SGB handles everything.

So without any legit hardware to steal power or push video out it cannot work with something like a Retron 5.

Actually the SNES hardware can be (and is) used by a couple of games when plugged into the super game boy.

From Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Game_Boy

"It is also possible for Super Game Boy games to make use of the SNES hardware for extra effects, as demonstrated in Contra: The Alien Wars, Donkey Kong, Kirby's Dream Land 2, A Bug's Life, Animaniacs and Toy Story; these games had expanded sound when used with the Super Game Boy. Wario Blast, the Game Boy version of Killer Instinct, and several other titles even allowed the second Super NES controller to be used for two-player action, and the title screen changed to show that these games had a two-player option, rather than a connection status."


Actually the SNES hardware can be (and is) used by a couple of games when plugged into the super game boy.

From Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Game_Boy

"It is also possible for Super Game Boy games to make use of the SNES hardware for extra effects, as demonstrated in Contra: The Alien Wars, Donkey Kong, Kirby's Dream Land 2, A Bug's Life, Animaniacs and Toy Story; these games had expanded sound when used with the Super Game Boy. Wario Blast, the Game Boy version of Killer Instinct, and several other titles even allowed the second Super NES controller to be used for two-player action, and the title screen changed to show that these games had a two-player option, rather than a connection status."

Ah didn't know that about the SGB. Thanks!

retroone

Also If you put a NES Game Genie into the Retron5 with a Game on the Game Genie, in mid gameplay you can unplug the game from the Game Genie and still play. Neat trick, just don't overuse it.

dashv

PRO Supporter

Also If you put a NES Game Genie into the Retron5 with a Game on the Game Genie, in mid gameplay you can unplug the game from the Game Genie and still play. Neat trick, just don't overuse it.

Yeah I reported that issue to them and they didn't seem bothered by it. :)

blipcs76

  • Guest
I'm not sure why Super Game Boy and Game Genie would be an issue when the system plays GB games already and has support for cheats built into the console.  Perhaps for the nostalgia of using those peripherals?  I have never used a Game Genie, so I guess I don't have any attachment to it.

dashv

PRO Supporter

I'm not sure why Super Game Boy and Game Genie would be an issue when the system plays GB games already and has support for cheats built into the console.  Perhaps for the nostalgia of using those peripherals?  I have never used a Game Genie, so I guess I don't have any attachment to it.

Super game boy is a non issue. People are just looking for reasons to hate with that one.

Game genie support I understand the issue people have.

Yes there is built in codes. But you cannot (easily) enter in your own and even if you manage to deal with their unwieldy XML file and raw format they don't actually support the full range of original game genie codes.

For example, most of the wacky world codes for SMB1 do not work.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2015, 02:41:32 pm by dashv »