Release Country TLD Master List

[theodw]

That is fine. I just changed the MX one to use the same reference for descriptor so for now it is easier than to figure out the country.
https://vgcollect.com/item/217221

Then how should it be done for upcoming NA releases, since there could be up to 5 versions in the region: USA (ESRB, English), Canada (ESRB, English/French), Brazil (English and/or Portuguese, ClassInd), Mexico (Spanish, SMECCV), and the rest of Latin America (English and/or Spanish, ESRB)? Do we still default Latin America for old releases (pre-SMECCV) as MX (English and/or Spanish, ESRB), unless specified in the box, and something new for the rest of the region?

[tripredacus]

That is fine. I just changed the MX one to use the same reference for descriptor so for now it is easier than to figure out the country.
https://vgcollect.com/item/217221

Then how should it be done for upcoming NA releases, since there could be up to 5 versions in the region: USA (ESRB, English), Canada (ESRB, English/French), Brazil (English and/or Portuguese, ClassInd), Mexico (Spanish, SMECCV), and the rest of Latin America (English and/or Spanish, ESRB)? Do we still default Latin America for old releases (pre-SMECCV) as MX (English and/or Spanish, ESRB), unless specified in the box, and something new for the rest of the region?

TLD is for the country the item is sold in, not what language is present. There is no default.

[theodw]

TLD is for the country the item is sold in, not what language is present. There is no default.

So, (Spanish cover), (Latin America), Back Code ID, anything? This needs a very specific rule, considering that the distribution chain in Latin America has always been scattered for this kind of products (My job is logistics related to the area).

[tripredacus]

TLD is for the country the item is sold in, not what language is present. There is no default.

So, (Spanish cover), (Latin America), Back Code ID, anything? This needs a very specific rule, considering that the distribution chain in Latin America has always been scattered for this kind of products (My job is logistics related to the area).

No I mean there is no default TLD. Descriptors like you put above (Spanish cover, Latin America) cannot be used.
If you don't know a country the game is sold in, you can use a descriptor but the descriptor should be some sort of number that is different. I just used the back number because the only other entry was the MX version and there was no US version with that name in the category.

[dhaabi]

TLD is for the country the item is sold in, not what language is present. There is no default.

So, (Spanish cover), (Latin America), Back Code ID, anything? This needs a very specific rule, considering that the distribution chain in Latin America has always been scattered for this kind of products (My job is logistics related to the area).

No I mean there is no default TLD. Descriptors like you put above (Spanish cover, Latin America) cannot be used.
If you don't know a country the game is sold in, you can use a descriptor but the descriptor should be some sort of number that is different. I just used the back number because the only other entry was the MX version and there was no US version with that name in the category.

Granted, we do know where the item was sold, provided by evidence from both theodw and nathan776. Using [MX] and [CL] TLDs instead of descriptors seems more ideal. If it's later learned that additional TLDs are appropriate to attach to either entry, then that can be done. After all, it isn't uncommon for that sort of action to be done for other entries.

[HN] could also be attached to 264558. Presumably [CO] as a third, but it's not quite confirmed yet due to censoring.

I found an Argentina version that has a back number of 3006527-AC and UPC of 711719547624 as well as a "Sony Argentina" import label. At least it seems that the back number may be unique between versions, as it does not match your pictures.

The same item is also listed from Uruguay, without a label.

[dhaabi]

TLD is for the country the item is sold in, not what language is present. There is no default.

So, (Spanish cover), (Latin America), Back Code ID, anything? This needs a very specific rule, considering that the distribution chain in Latin America has always been scattered for this kind of products (My job is logistics related to the area).

No I mean there is no default TLD. Descriptors like you put above (Spanish cover, Latin America) cannot be used.
If you don't know a country the game is sold in, you can use a descriptor but the descriptor should be some sort of number that is different. I just used the back number because the only other entry was the MX version and there was no US version with that name in the category.

Granted, we do know where the item was sold, provided by evidence from both theodw and nathan776. Using [MX] and [CL] TLDs instead of descriptors seems more ideal. If it's later learned that additional TLDs are appropriate to attach to either entry, then that can be done. After all, it isn't uncommon for that sort of action to be done for other entries.

[HN] could also be attached to 264558. Presumably [CO] as a third, but it's not quite confirmed yet due to censoring.

Both 217221 and 264558 have been updated to feature TLDs instead of descriptors.

[dhaabi]

I'm deciding to post this here instead of the style guide feedback topic since it is only here that the [NA] TLD is mentioned with the implication for it to be used as needed.

After handling an entry that needed TLDs which was submitted as being released in "North America, South America," I knew that [SA] would not be sufficient as that represents Saudi Arabia. However, I've now just realized that [NA] represents Namibia. While there are (as of now, to my knowledge) no items related to Namibia in the database, I suppose that could one day change. Regardless, it seems like poor practice to continue to use [NA] whenever we previously found it ideal. While I don't think there should be some mass effort to convert [NA] entries into whatever countries they actually released in (largely US but sometimes CA and MX), it may be best to use country-specific TLDs going forward.

And for those curious, [EU] does actually represent European Union, so I suppose it's still fine to use unless anyone makes an argument otherwise. It may make sense to retire that TLD too, though.

Thoughts?

[leonefamily]

Sounds good to me. I thought we already weren't supposed to use stuff like [NA] or [EU] in our TLDs anyways. For North America, I just leave no TLDs when referring to the default United States, or [CA] for a bilingual release or [CA][MX] for those trilingual releases.

Looking forward to the day we'll finally have the [QC] TLD, when my people decide to finally become an independant country.

Another system that could have been nice is to just have a new field that we can fill to an entry and this field just being flags of countries plus the European Union, with the ability to add more than one flag similar to what Redump does. This could allow to eliminate TLDs from titles.

[dhaabi]

Sounds good to me. I thought we already weren't supposed to use stuff like [NA] or [EU] in our TLDs anyways.

Another system that could have been nice is to just have a new field that we can fill to an entry and this field just being flags of countries plus the European Union, with the ability to add more than one flag similar to what Redump does. This could allow to eliminate TLDs from titles.

Normally, that's correct. Or, rather, it is correct for the majority of Games categories where the TLD is already built into the category name. However, there are plenty of categories which are for all regions—chiefly, for hardware and accessories categories which is where most of these entries with [NA] and [EU] as part of their name exist. For instance, the Nintendo 64 Consoles category from where you have the Nintendo 64 (Black) [NA] entry added to your collection.

What you're proposing with flags as an alternative is just a lateral move, really. We already have an ideal solution planned for how TLDs can be removed, but it's one dependent on time and effort being put in toward developing it. So, until such development is done, TLDs are just something we'll have to tolerate as we have been doing.

[tripredacus]

The use of things like [NA], [EU] and [JP] are from the origins of the site and pre-date the usage of TLDs. There is not a real solution we could institute that would be rules or Style Guide based that would properly replace the NA or EU options. It would have to involve a UX change. The option proposed before was that you could assign items to countries directly, which would also help for those items that are released in EU and AU for example.

I'm not saying we need to go on a crusade against NA or EU tld, but items that need TLD should have the confirmed TLD in the title. An entry for a US item that has NA should have US. Canada it is CA. Mexico it is MX. If it is confirmed the item is released in multiple countries without some tangible difference (Canadian or Mexican items might have different inserts or use a label) then you can compound them as we do normally. Items in South America would be done the same way. Just because it is read or understood a particular item was released to all of South America doesn't mean that it was for our purposes. As already stated about differences... And a South America release typically means "Except Brazil" due to them not using Spanish there. So it wouldn't mean you need to research and confirm an item in each and every South American country because it would be too much IMO. You can confirm one like Argentina and if it is later discovered an item was also in some other country then another TLD can be added later.

@leonefamily it seems like Alberta might beat Quebec to the punch... 

[leonefamily]

@leonefamily it seems like Alberta might beat Quebec to the punch... 

Yeah the whole Alberta thing is laughable. They only started talking about it when the conservatives lost the Canadian elections. They're not serious and if they were, their motive for independence is based solely on politics. Meanwhile our independence is based on 250 years of foreign occupation, it's based on cultural, demographical, historical, economical and linguistic differences. Alberta is not a distinct occupied nation trying to gain back its lost independence, contrary to Québec.

This is however out of topic for this thread, no need to talk further about it here. If you are really interested in Québec independence politics, feel free to ask me in private, I'm a member of various Québec independence groups (except I'm the only one operating abroad, from the Philippines).

Back to TLDs discussion...

[tripredacus]

So far there hasn't been a situation that I'm aware of where a QC TLD could be used. It would potentially only be an option where a Canadian game exists and then Quebec has a different release, probably one of those French imports. I know that we have handled the French imports before but I don't believe that we've had to resort to using a TLD to differentiate it, or even if Quebec ever gets a French import of a title that also gets a general Canadian only version.

[dhaabi]

So far there hasn't been a situation that I'm aware of where a QC TLD could be used. It would potentially only be an option where a Canadian game exists and then Quebec has a different release, probably one of those French imports. I know that we have handled the French imports before but I don't believe that we've had to resort to using a TLD to differentiate it, or even if Quebec ever gets a French import of a title that also gets a general Canadian only version.

There is at least one entry present which is specific to Québec that coincides with a Canada-specific entry which could use a TLD if we were to allow them.
https://vgcollect.com/item/251135
https://vgcollect.com/item/251136

Edit: And this item too, as 17282 could easily be supplied with [CA][US] which I've confirmed just now.
https://vgcollect.com/item/17282
https://vgcollect.com/item/238125

[tripredacus]

I had to verify, apparently Quebec doesn't actually have a country code TLD, theirs is .quebec which won't work for us. QC is the province abbreviation. If Quebec ever becomes their own country then we can do it.

[leonefamily]

I had to verify, apparently Quebec doesn't actually have a country code TLD, theirs is .quebec which won't work for us. QC is the province abbreviation. If Quebec ever becomes their own country then we can do it.

So far there hasn't been a situation that I'm aware of where a QC TLD could be used. It would potentially only be an option where a Canadian game exists and then Quebec has a different release, probably one of those French imports. I know that we have handled the French imports before but I don't believe that we've had to resort to using a TLD to differentiate it, or even if Quebec ever gets a French import of a title that also gets a general Canadian only version.

Yes I was referring to the day Québec becomes a country, it will use the [QC] TLD. For now, there are no cases where we need to use this TLD (plus it's not a valid TLD yet).

By the way, when this happens, it will somewhat complicate how we use TLDs because we will need to actually remember the specific date when independence was achieved and make sure that all releases before this date uses the [CA] TLD. A [QC] TLD would only make sense to apply to an item that was released AFTER independence. Of course, I doubt we will see many variants specific to Québec anyways, the exact same English/French boxes will likely continue to be used in both Canada and Québec after independence, so a [QC][CA] TLD or perhaps just one of the two could be used for all releases north of the USA. Unless Microsoft does what they used to do in the 2000s and starts releasing NTSC game art for Québec with French ONLY, these releases are listed as [CA] despite being exclusive to Québec and any new release like this would then get the [QC] TLD if released after independence.

Btw this scenario is not just hypothetical, but likely. The Parti Québécois is dominating the polls and if they win, they promised a new referendum before 2029. Support for independence has increased a lot lately, especially with Gen Zs who are now in majority in favor for independence.