Poll

Which method should we adopt for the Style Guide?

Method 1: Do not allow pack-in games from games or game packs
Method 2: Only allow pack-in games from games or game packs if the game has its own packaging
Method 3: Allow all pack-in games from games or game packs

Author Topic: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs  (Read 481 times)

tripredacus

Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« on: December 11, 2020, 12:24:09 pm »
Please read the entire thread before choosing a poll option. Poll will run for 7 days (give or take) and the results will win out and become the rule. Users have the ability to change their vote. Rules in the Style Guide can be voted on again in the future or new ones can be brought. You can submit additional ideas to bring up for voting in this thread:
https://vgcollect.com/forum/index.php/topic,8361.0.html

This poll is specifically to determine whether pack-in games from games or game packs are allowed to have individual or loose media entries in the appropriate games category. Currently pack-in games from consoles or accessory packs are allowed separate entries in the relevant games category which also includes loose media versions where no game packaging is included AND those releases are different, unique or have some variation that is not present in a standalone release of that game.

Examples
1. Individually packaged pack-in games from game packs
Dead or Alive Ultimate (Xbox)
main set: https://vgcollect.com/item/214
DOA1: https://vgcollect.com/item/43007
DOA2: https://vgcollect.com/item/32193

Sled Storm / The Need for Speed III / NASCAR Rumble - Collector's Edition (PlayStation)
main set: https://vgcollect.com/item/182361
Sled Storm: https://vgcollect.com/item/28891
NFS III: https://vgcollect.com/item/77625
NASCAR Rumble: https://vgcollect.com/item/77626

2. Loose pack-in games from games
Bayonetta 2 (Bonus Bayonetta Game Included) (Wii U)
Primary release includes 2 discs: Bayonetta 2 and Bayonetta https://vgcollect.com/item/33978
There is no additional entry for Bayonetta 2.
There is an entry for the Bayonetta disc: https://vgcollect.com/item/80602

3. Loose pack-in games from game packs
Half-Life: Platinum Collection (PC)
Main pack: https://vgcollect.com/item/8440
Includes 4 individual discs.
Other examples:
- cassette game multi-packs for micros like C64 or Amstrad CPC
- that CE that has all of the Final Fantasy games on separate discs (I think it is Final Fantasy but I can't find it now)
- Game releases that have an additional DLC disc

The choices are as follows:

Method 1: Do not allow pack-in games from games or game packs
The simplest method, where the entries for a game release or a game pack are considered complete, and additional entries are not created for add-in games or the individual games of a multi-game pack. The user would leverage the notes section when adding an item to thier collection to indicate the completeness.
Implications using the Examples
- The main Dead or Alive Ultimate entry would be allowed, but the two individual game entries would be deleted.
- The PlayStation CE entry would be allowed, but the three individual game entries would be deleted.
- The Bayonetta 2 entry would be allowed, but the loose Bayonetta disc entry would be deleted.
- The Half-Life entry would be allowed, but the 4 loose discs would not be allowed separate entries.

Method 2: Only allow pack-in games from games or game packs if the game has its own packaging
This option would allow for the pack-in games to have entries created that have separate packaging within another game or game pack would be allowed an entry, but a game without separate packaging would not. Same as above regarding notes section.
Implications using the Examples
- The main Dead or Alive Ultimate entry and the two individual game entries would be allowed.
- The PlayStation CE entry and the three individual game entries would be allowed.
- The Bayonetta 2 entry would be allowed, but the Bayonetta loose disc entry would be deleted.
- The Half-Life entry would be allowed, but the 4 loose discs would not be allowed separate entries.

Method 3: Allow all pack-in games from games or game packs
Would allow for separate entries for all pack-in games from games or game packs, whether or not they have separate packaging.  This would allow for loose game discs, carts or cassettes to have a separate entry outside of the game pack. A downside to this option is that it would produce additional clutter into game categories, especially in any computer category. It would also produce "dupes" concerning game multi-packs such as the Half-Life example or in general collection packs, or as noted in the below Final Fantasy example, or those PC Game budget releases that can have up to 20 different game CDs in them.
Implications using the Examples
- The main Dead or Alive Ultimate entry and the two individual game entries would be allowed. Loose disc entries would not be allowed.
- The PlayStation CE entry and the three individual game entries would be allowed. Loose disc entries would not be allowed.
- The Bayonetta 2 entry and the loose Bayonetta disc entries would be allowed. The Bayonetta 2 disc would not get a separate entry.
- The Half-Life entry and the four loose discs would be allowed separate entries.
- Both discs from Final Fantasy Chronicles would be allowed separate loose disc entries.

NOTE: None of these options would allow for loose or individually packaged stand-alone games from within regular packaging (such as an edition box) to have a separate entry. This is only to be regarding instances where more than 1 game exists within a single package.

You can change your mind and change your vote if you like.

Original discussion thread is here:
https://vgcollect.com/forum/index.php/topic,11206.0.html

pzeke

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2020, 01:53:55 pm »
Sneaky move switching options...

tripredacus

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2020, 03:26:57 pm »
The third option was always a middle ground option, it just hadn't come up at first in the discussion topic. It is better to arrange it in the order it is now (or 3-1 would have been the same) as it shows a progression from more strict to less strict.

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2020, 03:46:28 pm »
And to clarify on what an approved Method 3 would look like, an existing and obviously divisive entry for Final Fantasy Chronicle's individual Chrono Trigger disc is here versus its complete counterpart. However, as tripredacus has already mentioned, if Method 3 is voted to be approved as the ruling guideline, Final Fantasy Chronicle's individual Final Fantasy IV disc would also be permitted to have its own entry.

tripredacus

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2020, 04:04:27 pm »
Yes, that is the implication. The Half-Life is a better example because it is more extreme because it has more discs. It isn't the most extreme example I could think of, as I noted, I can't remember what that one box set is that has like a dozen discs in it. I recall it is a Japanese release, and actually spans PS2/PS3 and or PSP in it. Some game series. Might not have been Final Fantasy but for some reason I thought it was. Anyways, the same would apply to that as well.

The thing I fear here is having to make an executive decision. This really should be made by everyone, that's why it goes to a poll. But I hope there isn't some problem that arises when Method 3 wins and a bunch of us start adding loose discs, carts and cassettes into every category. Even so, a revote is allowed on (almost) anything in the Style Guide, so we could end up having to revote after a week or two if people do not like that outcome.

Also I am putting this type of response into a reply rather than the first post. I wanted to make sure I did not put my opinion in the first post at all so that people can decide on their own. I voted for Method 2, which allows the pack-in games that have packaging. I do not think we should have the individual discs in the DB like the Bayonetta or Chrono Trigger examples at this time. Rather, that should be something we hold off on until someday when we can be able to add contents of a game to an entry.

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2020, 04:07:50 pm »
Yes, that is the implication. The Half-Life is a better example because it is more extreme because it has more discs. It isn't the most extreme example I could think of, as I noted, I can't remember what that one box set is that has like a dozen discs in it. I recall it is a Japanese release, and actually spans PS2/PS3 and or PSP in it. Some game series. Might not have been Final Fantasy but for some reason I thought it was. Anyways, the same would apply to that as well.

The thing I fear here is having to make an executive decision. This really should be made by everyone, that's why it goes to a poll. But I hope there isn't some problem that arises when Method 3 wins and a bunch of us start adding loose discs, carts and cassettes into every category. Even so, a revote is allowed on (almost) anything in the Style Guide, so we could end up having to revote after a week or two if people do not like that outcome.

Also I am putting this type of response into a reply rather than the first post. I wanted to make sure I did not put my opinion in the first post at all so that people can decide on their own. I voted for Method 2, which allows the pack-in games that have packaging. I do not think we should have the individual discs in the DB like the Bayonetta or Chrono Trigger examples at this time. Rather, that should be something we hold off on until someday when we can be able to add contents of a game to an entry.
This?

Final Fantasy: 25th Anniversary Ultimate Box
https://vgcollect.com/item/151543


pzeke

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #6 on: December 11, 2020, 06:10:07 pm »
The third option was always a middle ground option, it just hadn't come up at first in the discussion topic. It is better to arrange it in the order it is now (or 3-1 would have been the same) as it shows a progression from more strict to less strict.

Okay, I get that, but maybe that should've been established from the moment the poll options were presented in the previous discussion instead of sneaking the switch on the official poll, regardless of whether they were preliminary or not.

Either way, my vote remains the same: method 2; it's the most logical and sensible option.

This?

Final Fantasy: 25th Anniversary Ultimate Box
https://vgcollect.com/item/151543

Well, if I remember correctly from a video I saw some time ago, each game had its own packaging, so that one would fall under the second method. But let's be honest here; what are the odds of someone owning just one or a few of those without the original packaging? Just because the second option states the games can be submitted individually doesn't necessarily mean that they have to if you own the entire package; it's more in the event someone comes along and just has a copy of Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas from the Grand Theft Auto: The Trilogy bundle, just to name an example.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2020, 06:11:59 pm by pzeke »

tripredacus

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2020, 11:53:35 am »
Yes, that is the implication. The Half-Life is a better example because it is more extreme because it has more discs. It isn't the most extreme example I could think of, as I noted, I can't remember what that one box set is that has like a dozen discs in it. I recall it is a Japanese release, and actually spans PS2/PS3 and or PSP in it. Some game series. Might not have been Final Fantasy but for some reason I thought it was. Anyways, the same would apply to that as well.

The thing I fear here is having to make an executive decision. This really should be made by everyone, that's why it goes to a poll. But I hope there isn't some problem that arises when Method 3 wins and a bunch of us start adding loose discs, carts and cassettes into every category. Even so, a revote is allowed on (almost) anything in the Style Guide, so we could end up having to revote after a week or two if people do not like that outcome.

Also I am putting this type of response into a reply rather than the first post. I wanted to make sure I did not put my opinion in the first post at all so that people can decide on their own. I voted for Method 2, which allows the pack-in games that have packaging. I do not think we should have the individual discs in the DB like the Bayonetta or Chrono Trigger examples at this time. Rather, that should be something we hold off on until someday when we can be able to add contents of a game to an entry.
This?

Final Fantasy: 25th Anniversary Ultimate Box
https://vgcollect.com/item/151543

Ah it being in Other explains why my searches weren't finding it.
The pictures I saw of it had just shown the discs by themselves, perhaps it was some sort of stock photo.

tripredacus

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2020, 10:27:11 am »
Bump, one day left!

tripredacus

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2020, 01:06:10 pm »
Voting locked. Method 2 is the winner. Will update the Style Guides on Monday.

tripredacus

Re: Style Guide Poll #5: Pack-in Games from Games or Game Packs
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2020, 11:14:56 am »
Adv Guide updated in the Platform section:
https://vgcollect.com/forum/index.php/topic,10837.msg178154.html#msg178154

Quote
Pack-in Games from Games or individual games from Multi-Packs
Pack-in games from games or individual games from multi-game packs are allowed to have a separate entry if the additional game has its own packaging. Loose games from games or multi-packs are not allowed a loose entry and are considered to be part of the whole entry.
Examples
Dead or Alive Ultimate was released as a box set that includes DOA1 and DOA2 in their own cases. These two games from within the game pack are allowed separate entries.
Half-Life Platinum Collection is a multipack that includes Half-Life, TFC, Opposing Force and Counter-Strike on individual discs with no unique packaging. Entries for these individual discs are not permitted.
Bayonetta 2 (Bonus Bayonetta Game Included) was released on Wii U and contains an additional disc for Bayonetta in the case. Since this additional disc does not have its own packaging, an entry for the individual disc is not permitted.

Let me know if that description needs to be modified or if it is confusing.

Also added a clarification for to "Pack-in Items That are Not Games or Accessories" to add soundtracks to the list of items that are allowed separate entries.

Removed the Chrono Trigger and Bayonetta loose disc entries.